To understand the divine you have to become a self realised person 1991-04-18
Current language: English, list all talks in: English
18 April 1991
To Understand The Divine You Have To Become A Self Realised Person
Public Program
Newcastle City Hall, Newcastle (Australia)
Talk Language: English | Transcript (English) – Draft
Public Program & Music (by Nirmal Sangeet Sarita and the late Baba Mama). Newcastle (Australia) 18 April 1991.
48:00
[??: meaning not clear/not audible]
I bow to all the seekers of truth. At the very outset, I have to say that truth is what it is. We cannot organise it, we cannot conceptualise it. Also unfortunately, we cannot know the absolute truth at this human awareness. We have to become a subtler being to know the truth. Now whatever I am telling you today here has to be understood with an open mind of a scientist. If it is a hypothesis I am putting before you, you have to see for yourself if it works then as honest people you must admit because this is for everybody's emancipation and the emancipation of the whole world. We have seen there are problems in every place, in every country, in every nation. Problems of different nature are there. But if you go to the roots of it you will find out that its human beings who have created these problems. And these problems exists because we are in ignorance, we are sitting in darkness and we do not know how we are related to each other. We talk of collectivity, we talk of peace, we talk of love; but still, we are separated from each other. And it's like a drop away from the ocean talking about the ocean. In every scripture, whether it is Christian, Hindu, Muslim, is Tao or Zen, any one of these philosophies of Buddha or of Mahavira it is said that to understand the divine you have to become a self realised person or as you say a second birth has to happen within us. How is it all of them said one simple thing that you have to have your second birth. But that does not mean that you can just have a certificate saying I am this, I am that. Because we are not. We do not practice what we are talking about. There is a disparity. And the reason is that we have not reached that second birth; otherwise automatically you start practicing what you preach. For example, anybody who is a Hindu, Muslim, Sikh or anything can commit any sin what so ever; though he may go to temple, may go to mosque, may go to church. So there is something lacking in us, some sort of a incapibility within us that we cannot do what we want to do. I have known many people who were alcoholics, who were drug addicts who came into Sahaja Yoga, and they said that mother it's impossible, we cannot give up, we haven't got strength. We are so much against it, we don't want it, but we just can't do it. So helpless. And... yesterday only there was a lady an actress who came to me, poor thing, she just asked me one thing, mother please relieve me from this alcoholism. I am a terrible alcoholic and my life is now about to finish. Now you give them lectures, you tell them something, it wouldn't work out. Through your mental efforts, nothing is going to work out. So there is something higher that has to happen to us that you become capable of enjoying that value system which you regard as something great. That those great prophets and incarnations have talked about. What is that missing point, is very simple, that in our evolutionary process we have become human beings. But we have not yet known the absolute truth and a absolute knowledge. And that's why all these problems are there. Once you become the truth it starts acting on your central nervous system. And this is what is ‘being born again'. He has already told you about this whole system which works it out. It is within us, built-in. Our creator is the greatest planner you can think of. He has kept these two things like your past and your future on both the sides. And the middle path is kept open about which Buddha has spoken so that you can ascent easily and achieve your self realisation. In India, there was a tradition that only one teacher had only one disciple. It was not allowed to have any more disciple because they thought it is impossible. Then in the 12th century [ie 1200s], there was a great poet called as Gyaneshwara who wrote in a vernacular language. Of course in Sanskrit language, there are so many books written very much about kundalini awakening, about kundalini and all the processes. But Sanskrit being such a difficult language that general public did not know about it and those who were in charge of religion or we can call ones who knew Sanskrit, didn't know how to do it. But he took permission from his teacher, who was his brother, that he should allow him to talk about this inner power about divinity openly to people. So he wrote in his beautiful book called Gyaneshwari, in the 6th chapter about this kundalini. But still, people said, no no no no, this chapter is to be closed down this is not for us. Now only it has become possible to talk about it and to awaken the kundalini of people amass. Masses and multitudes can get realisation. Of course all these incarnations and all these prophets have worked for it. And they have brought us to this level that now we can get this experience of self realisation. Now I have to tell you that its a living process of a living energy and you cannot pay for it. For eg. If you sow a seed in the mother earth, it sprouts by itself. You do not have to pay money to the mother earth, she doesn't understand. We understand that she doesn't know money. In the same way, this living force that is within you is your own within yourself, we say as the kundalini because it has got coils, is the mother the primordial mother. We can call her the holy ghost reflected within you. And for her awakening or for any such work which has to do with divinity, you cannot pay. You cannot also put in much effort because to become human beings we have not put in much effort. In the same way, it happens so spontaneously that you don't have to worry about it. But as a result of that what happens to you is that you feel for the first time the truth that there is the all pervading power of divine love. (You) Start feeling a cool breeze in your hands and a cool breeze of the holy ghost also comes out of your head and you can feel it. And for the first time, you know that there is some subtler energy beyond what we know of. And this energy is the energy that does all the living work.
58.31
This divine love is the energy which thinks, understands, organises. Above all it loves. We never even think like how these beautiful flowers have come out of one seed. We never even bother to know how we are made so beautifully. How our eyes are made so beautiful, such a beautiful camera. We do not try to understand because we take it for granted. It's a living process. And living process we do not want to get into. But these are special times when we are born. Modern times as you say are also described in all the books, to be the ones where will be quiet in illusions and will be quiet disturbed by the different ideologies that will be bombarding us. But in those times only the seekers will be born and these seekers of truth will get their self realisation. Even William Blake has said that Men of God will be born on this earth and they will seek God. Not only that but they will Godliness to others. So such a time has arrived for us to receive your self realisation, your self knowledge, by which you know about yourself, about your centres and also you know what's wrong with others because a new awareness is manifested in your central nervous system. You can feel the centres of your own being and you can feel the centres of other people, very clearly on your fingertips as shown there. And if you know how to correct those centres you can get rid of all the problems created by these centres and they are the ones when they go out of order or imbalances, you get your physical, mental, emotional and spiritual problems. So when this kundalini rises she pierces through, like a thread into pearls, and integrate all these centres and then ultimately she breaks through the fontanelle bone area which was a soft bone in your childhood; giving you the actualisation, again I say actualisation of baptism. Is described in all the religions. Now on Easter, we give eggs to people. What is the significance of we giving we are giving eggs to people? Because Christ came on this Earth with a purpose. And his purpose that he should establish our resurrection. That he resurrected himself. He is placed on this centre, you see like this is the centre, is optic chiasma. And that's why because he was on this centre (agnya) which looks after our eyes, he has said it thou shall not have adulterous eyes. Why did he talk of eyes so much, because he was placed on this optic chiasma. And when the kundalini passes through he is awakened within us. Then he sucks these two institutions there, left and right, which we call as ego and superego where your karmas are there, your conditionings are there are all sucked in. And then the area which we call as limbic area, opens out like this and through that the kundalini passes and you get your self realisation.
1.02.56
But while travelling through these centres, not only that it brings those centres to their proper position; like if there is one centre on the left and one centre on the right, now if you start using (centre) too much then what happens this centre becomes very constricted or the energy becomes exhausted. And sometimes any shock can just break them. And when they are broken you develop diseases which we call as psychosomatic like cancer and others which are incurable. But this kundalini is very wise. She passes through one and then to another and brings them together (left and right together), nourishes them and then she goes ahead to integrate all of them. Not only that but it is connected with that all pervading power. Once this connection is established fully, it starts flowing, the energy starts flowing through you and you are never tired. You become extremely dynamic at the same time extremely compassionate. Because this energy is the source of compassion, love and bliss. This is what is waiting for us.
So the first truth is, the fundamental truth is that you are not this body or this mind or this conditionings or ego, but you are the pure spirit. And the second one is that there is this all pervading power which we have to feel in our central nervous system so that we can definitely help ourselves and help others. Thus we get our transformation. And this transformation is going to transform the whole world because then we find the peace within yourself. Then you find your witness state and you are above all the turmoils of the world. And you can see them (turmoil) very clearly; because if you are in the water you are afraid of the waves, but if you are in a boat you can see all those waves nicely. Apart from that supposing, you learn swimming you can jump down and save so many of them who are getting drowned and who are afraid of these waves. So its a very very spontaneous collective working. From one person to another, from one to thousands you can get them self realisation because you get the power to give realisation to others and to sooth them to comfort them. You also get all the power because you are completely counselled, all the knowledge you know everything about it. You know how it works. There is complete open knowledge of the modus operandi of everything Sahaja Yoga is doing. Anybody who is a Sahaja yogi, which is the THIRD STAGE as I call it, can tell you about Sahaja Yoga, can explain to you, can work it out. The FIRST STAGE where the kundalini rises above this centre which I told you as optic chiasma, then you become thoughtlessly aware. You are neither in the past or in the future. You are in the present. There are no thoughts. You become thoughtlessly aware. But when this kundalini passes through this (Sahasrara) centre (the second stage) and your connections are established, then you become doubtlessly aware. This doubtless awareness is a state where you start understanding Sahaja Yoga and also the manifestation of your own being. You start understanding yourself and understanding others without any doubts. Then the THIRD STAGE is where you practice it, you give to others, you make them self realised people then you become a perfect sahaja yogi. They are very humble, angelic people. My husband always says that "see you got all the angels of the whole world, and in this United Nations of the world what sort of people have come, because they are supposed to be United Nations; I don't when they will be united. It's such a difficult thing to deal with them." So this has to happen. Already predicted. And if this does not happen then this creation will be finished. But our creator has become so anxious that such a thing should happen that this all pervading power has become extremely dynamic. And that's how I am taking full advantage of it. And I hope you take advantage of it and achieve that for which you are born as human beings, the last breakthrough of your evolution. In such a small I am sorry I wouldn't be able to elaborately all about it. But I think in English language only I must have had at least 3-4 thousand lectures. And there are other languages also I speak. So I would request you not to worry about the knowledge part. See now there are beautiful lights here. When you come you just have to switch on one switch and all of them come. But supposingly I start telling you about electricity or the invention of the electricity and how it came and how it was brought in new castle, will be all bored stiff. So the best thing is to get the light and in that light, you understand that there is the subtle subject and easily very easily understood when you have your spirit.
1.09.44
I don't know we have had so far a tradition that you can ask me questions and if you think proper, ask me questions. Now I must tell you that I have been doing this work for last 20 years and I have travelled at least 45 nations. And there are Sahaja Yogis about 55 nations that's what they tell me. So I am quiet ?? at answering all your questions. I know what sort of question you will ask. But only thing I have to tell you that I have not come here to take anything from you. Nor am I here to order you for anything. I respect your freedom. Those who want to have self realisation only they can get their realisation. We are not going to force on you. It cannot be forced. It is like this. It has to be asked in your liberty in your freedom. So the question should be relevant with our subject and should not be aggressive to waste our time. I request all of you; I am so happy to see all of you seekers in this beautiful town. I wish they were the same in New Castle in England. I don't know think they are so many there. But one thing about English I have seen they are hard hard nuts to crack. But there is something good about them is that once they get it, nothing like English. Because they settle down within. And they are scholarship, such a lot of scholarship. They settle down with it. And today we have in foundation of Sahaja yoga seven hippies who came to sahaja in England who were very well educated. There were doctors and philosophers and professors and all that. But they had taken to hippy style of life, I don't know why. And they told me it was for seeking. And now they are very great Sahaja yogis. One of the doctors I know of who is in charge of 7 psychiatric hospital who are suffering from drug addiction and to alcoholism. We have another doctor who is a Russian who has been in Australia all his life, then he came to London and now he is working in Russia for the Russian people. Because we have found Russians to be very sensitive to spirituality. They have now conditionings. They are very clean. And they are so sensitive that they thrown away all the false gurus and all the false things from their country. And just they are now in Sahaja yoga and thousands and thousands. We have to always use a big stadium for them. Still, people are sitting on the ground. 16000 people minimum are to be accommodated. So you can imagine what a tremendous country that is. And why not we also open our hearts, see for ourselves whatever is good for us and for our children. Because it does so many things for the whole family for the whole nation for the whole world. So we all should be a part and parcel of that. May God Bless you.
1.13.17
Q: [not audible] Sy: Why there so many different styles of yoga, kinds of yoga. What is the difference?
Shri Mataji: Very good idea. Very good question also. See the Yoga system was established by a great scholar called Patanjali and he had written a book which is as thick as this much. This book, Patanjali's book, has described 8 types of things that are to be done. Ashtangas. 8 fold we can say. Among them, was yama, niyama means the rules and regulations and very brief part of it was the exercises (asanas). But these were all different steps. Then there is another where he has clearly described the Raja yoga. In Raja yoga, he has described that when the kundalini rises then, just like I would say a modern simili I would give you like a car when it starts all the machinery starts working by itself. In the same manner when this kundalini rises all the machinery within starts working. Like one centre opens out and another centre is closed, the one which is open pushes the kundalini upward and closes down and the upper centre then opens. This is simply what we call is Raja yoga. And when it passes through this (vishuddhi) centre you get a kind of a suction by the kundalini because she wants to be retained at this point so she doesn't fall down with energy, whatever with small energy it's coming up so there is an augmentation means there is a contraction there. This is called as khecahri. Is all described in a way that when all this thing happen within ourselves they are spontaneous. But you see these are half baked people. They say, first of all, I mean you will be surprised that I have seen this there is one association of some Yogananda or something; in the beginning of it they made people cut their thread of their tongue and push it back to get the khechari. I mean it is like something like your car which is not yet ignited (started) to move the wheel, something like that. It's all artificial. And also the physical exercises that are done these days are not from Patanjali. They are their own made, you see now American, ??, then everybody has added to it. But these physical exercises are suggested for this kundalini rising. Because supposing there is problem on your spinal cord, they may also tell you to do certain type of exercise, certain type. But it is like taking medicine pf every kind without description from medicine box. So this is also absolutely wrong because there is no need to do any exercises in Sahaja Yoga. But later on when kundalini moves and we find out that somebody has a spinal cord problem because somebody has an accident or something then we might tell him to do exercise a particular one. That's all. Ones it's corrected it's finished. You see it is more sort of a money making proposition of these people that they started taking one strand from here and one strand from there and created so many yogas. So all this yogas that they talk of, now recently I have heard of other yogas like, I must warn you because I am not afraid of them, one is TM. I must tell you about TM. This TM people, first of all, a Indian came to me when there was the director, the chief man, of their flying academy. His name was Mr. Peter Peres and he was from South Africa and a diamond merchant. And his wife was the granddaughter of a Duke. And her daughter, and Dy. Director all of them came to me suffering from horrible epilepsy. They are falling on the street. And this lady used to into screams for 3-3 hours. And they told us that now they have become completely bankrupt. They told me all about it. And he is writing a book about it. Imagine these people charge 300 pounds for giving a mantra. Now there are Indian will laugh at it because it's absurd. But was kept as big big big secrets. The 3 mantras were Inga, Pinga, Thinga. They (Indians) have already started laughing. Now inga means a scorpion bite that is also not Sanskrit. Pinga means when a person gets possessed and goes round and round and round. And thinga means showing like this (thumbs). They paid 300 pounds, all of them. Headlong into it. Then second thing they did that was to charge them 6000 pounds. They had to go to Switzerland in some remote hotel and sit on some cushions and jump for flying in the air. I mean imagine, can't understand why do you want to fly in air about 3 feet, imagine. Already we have problem with our traffic here. But if we ask for such stupid things, they know how stupid you are, they want to charge you. 6000 pounds were charged. And they were told that you will be flying 3 feet higher above the ground. They broke all their bottoms. There are so many case against this man (TM) now in America. So many cases. Then they gave them the water which has boiled the potatoes for 6 days and the 7th day they gave the [rind ??] of the potato and the 8th-day potatoes. That is the end of 6000 pounds. Where 1000s of them were there.
There is one lady who is a barrister who went there, her sister was little mad, because they were also mesmerised. She became mad, she went into lunatic asylum. Now both of them have come to Sahaja Yoga and they are alright.
They (TM people) are all marketing. And now they are marketing Ayurveda. What is there for them to market? Anybody can get ayurvedic medicines. Moreover, Ayurveda is not possible in these countries because they are done with fresh leaves. And you cant get those fresh leaves as we can get in our country but still, you can make them into something and can be sold. But for that you don't need a guru, you need a doctor. So all such things are there.
Now recently I read a horrible article about this guru Maee's father who was actually her guru. Horrible. That if you read that article you will really feel like vomiting. He used to use 13 year old girls for abuse. Is given in American paper so clearly. But still, people are paying. The other day we had 5 ladies who came from this guru Maee who were, just they came before me and there whole stomach started getting nervous, everything getting nervous. We had to work so hard on them. They have already paid 400 dollars for intensive and 100 dollars for a shawl. Which was meditation shawl. Can you imagine? And get what this kind of nervousness in the stomach. I have to tell you this very frankly. Because this is going on and on and on. One after another they will come. You should not at all trush anyone who takes money from you to begin with. Secondly, you must see the disciples of such person. Anybody who talks of God, big big things you see, what is his own life and how are his disciples, what sort of people are they. Have they got something more than you have got? Otherwise, why should you go to them? You must use your logic and your brains, first, and see for yourselves that you are going to the right person. You see because they that you do not know about these subtle things, they come and exploit you. And I feel ashamed of it as an Indian. What can we do? They cannot work it out more in India because Indians innately know who is who in this respect. They may not know politics economics. But this they know very well. And that's how they (Indians) are saved and we do not have money to waste also for these people. Who has got 6000 pounds so much to waste to fly in the air. In India no one has.
We must understand we should try to find out what sort of people these are. And what kind of life they are leading. Their insincerity is writ large on their faces. If you are sensitive like Russians you will find it out. So all these yogas are created for money orientation. But the main thing is the yoga is the union with the divine. That is what we have to have. These were all steps suggested in those days. But now is the jet age. And I think kundalini has also become like a jet. And whatever you maybe you will get realisation. Yesterday we had 15000 people and all of them practically except for 5-6 people didn't get it. Even journalist got it, even bureaucrats got it, can you beat that. In one shot. Poor thing because they are so much under tensions that I didn't expect. Because I have lived my whole if with them I know how tensed they are. But they all got it. It was remarkable. Is a very good question. I am happy because I could tell these things to you. I have said this from 1970s about all of them about Rajneesh this that. But you will be surprised none of them has filed a suit against me. None of them. But no one would listen to me. When I went to America they asked me how many Rolls Royces you have? I mean imagine the TV people. I said I have no Rolls Royces. Then we are not interested we are not in the business. Can you imagine such a thing?
Very good question I must say. Thank you for that. Normally I don't talk about these things but now it has become essential we all are warned about it.
1.28.07
Q: [not audible]
Sy: Psychosomatic diseases related to the system.
Shri Mataji: How is it related you are saying?Alright. Now the. I will tell you. Now. You didn't tell them about the three channels. Now. There are 3 channels you can see clearly. One is the blue one, another one is the yellow one and there is the central path. Now the left side and the right side of the sympathetic nervous system is nourished by them and the centre is the parasympathetic nervous system. This is medical terminology. But in psychological terminology, we can say that the left side one is the psyche. Of course it is not the psyche of the Mr. Freud because I think he was quiet half baked. He didn't understand the totality of human beings and he has reduced human beings to a sex point. I mean it's so demeaning the way he has done the whole thing. Alright, whatever it is. This the left side is the psyche and the right side is the somatic side means left side is the power of desire. Beyond this is the subconscious mind, collective subconscious mind. The right side is the power of action which acts through our physical and mental activities. Beyond this is the supraconscious, is the future and also the collective supraconscious. So these are two areas. So one is the left as I showed you and the right (shown by hand position ). When these centres are in trouble, the psyche is in trouble sometimes, sometimes only the right side the somatic side. But when both of them break away from the centre then the psychosomatic troubles are caused which are incurable. So Sahaja yoga can cure physical aspect, mental aspect and also the combination of physical and mental. Is it alright sir?
Q : [not audible]
Shri Mataji: You see also the saints have written as to how to make out a Sadguru, is the real guru. Is very clear. It is said that you should not give any money to a guru. Guru has to be above ??. A guru is a person who has gravity, who is higher than normal people. But a person who is looking into your purses, how can he be a guru? Is you servant. So the concept of guru is alright. But that doesn't mean any person coming out of the jail and wears those dresses like a guru and says that he is a guru, you should follow him. You must understand that the guru has to have those qualities of purity and holiness. I am not saying you could not have gurus, you should have. We have had such great gurus like Guru Nanak we had, we had Ramdasa, we Gyaneshwara, we had so many of them in our country. And also we had them outside that we think that the primordial masters only incarnated as Abraham, as Moses. Later on as also Lao-tse. All these people are the incarnation of the same guru. Even last one who was the Sainath of Shirdi, not the Satya Saibaba, but Sainath of Shirdi. He was one of the last Gurus. So they were real gurus. They were not interested in your money or in your women, all nonsensical things like that. So that is what, a saying Guru Nanak has said ‘Sadguru wahee jo Sahib mili hai'. To God, they call Sahib means God. The one who is the real Guru is the one who makes you meet God. That's the sign. Alright. So concept has to be understood fully. But these days you see we Indian are also keeping a guru like a telephone in the house, All of us must have some guru somewhere hanging. That's very wrong. You must judge the guru. Otherwise, even if a telephone is not working why do you want to keep it in the house?
Q : [not audible]
Sy: She understands this is a spontaneous occasion when kundalini rises. But is there something we can do to create an atmosphere to help that.
Shri Mataji: Yes, of course. Just now we will work it out. You all will get your realisation I am sure the way you are. After that you emit this, you emit spirituality. Because you are such a beautiful person then. I mean the whole beauty is within yourself. You have not touched your depth. You are not seeing that you are full of divinity. When it starts emitting its vibrations then you change the atmosphere, you change the people, you change everyone. But first, you must get your connection. And then.
Alright. So let's have now the process of, this thing will take about 10-15 minutes at the most.
I have already told you that self realisation cannot be forced on anyone. You are respected, your freedom is respected, and you have to ask for it. Otherwise, I cannot force on you. Human beings have been given freedom because ultimately we have to rise to their full freedom. When you are so capable that you can bear your freedom, you can assert your freedom in such a manner that it doesn't hurt any body's freedom.
I am sorry I have been talking every day and every night the programme used to finish at 2'o clock, 3'o clock. So little bit my throat is ..
For this also we have to understand that we have to take the help of the mother earth and for that, we have to take out our shoes.
1.36.37
[Realisation follows ]