See the quality of the disciples of the gurus first 1990-06-21
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21 June 1990
See The Quality Of The Disciples Of The Gurus First
Public Program
Athens (Greece)
Talk Language: English | Transcript (English) – Draft
H.H. Shri Mataji Nirmala Devi, 1990-0621 Public Program Day 2, Athens, Greece.
I bow to all the Seekers of Truth. Yesterday I told you what is the truth is. Truth is that you are the spirit and that there is an All Pervading Power, which does all the living work and looks after you also. Now the questions are some of the them are sensible, I’m happy that they are asking Me questions, which means that you have all the freedom to ask questions, there’s no mesmerism going on.
The first question is about how to make out a false guru. First thing, I must say that that is a false guru will not give you all the freedom to ask questions, so you can’t object anymore. A guru who does not give you any freedom to ask questions, is not good. But you have to know that you cannot pay for the truth. For example, I can see with My eye that there is a carpet lying here. You know that. I don’t have to pay. I have got My eyes. In the same way, to know the truth, you cannot pay any money.
The second point is that you must see what is the quality of the disciples of the gurus first. When you go to a shop, you want to buy something, first you find out from those who have bought, what do they have to say about it. You’ll be surprised, that none of these so called gurus have any disciples who have any idea as to what is the truth nor do they know about Kundalini or they have any knowledge about their spirit. Nor do they lead a life, which is righteous, which is saintly. On the contrary they lead a very evil life sometimes, if they do not live an evil life they are always sick people, they get into trouble.
As a Mother I would say, what has your guru given you? Maybe you might be saying that he has given you peace or something like that. It could be just some mesmerism for the time being like that you go into a pub and drink something, you feel a little nice for a while. Then these gurus never talk against each other they never tell somebody’s faults never because Christ has said that Satan will never speak against his own house. There’s a mutual understanding between all of them to loot you and to exploit you. I know some of them, as people they have to come to see me, from those who are suffering because of their heart.
So I have told you that you are not even to believe Me, what I’m saying, blindly, till you get your Realisation. But you have keep your minds open, very open like a scientist, listen to what I’m saying and, very soon and if you are real seekers, you’ll get it. But a kind of a, I call it a superior intelligence, you can call it a superior divining elements some people have that they immediately can make out who is real and who is not. A person who cares too much about his body, too much about his appearance, all kinds of pretentions, and a person who a, is so much worried about his food and his sleep and his comfort, and is living in a very luxurious manner at the cost of other’s money, all these things should tell you that this man cannot be a saint.
I’ve know of a guru who have mantras to people, in TM, he gave mantras to people, which if you tell any Indian, he’ll laugh and he’ll say what stupid mantras these are! And it was kept a secret, absolutely a secret. There should be no secrecy. Everyone should know everything about the guru, where he gets his money, where he spends it, everything should be known.
Now this TM I came to know because there a gentleman who was in a, Scotland, who was running a, who was running a very big foundation for ‘flying in the air’! He, his wife, his child and his director, all suffering from epilepsy, came to me to get cured. His name was Mr. Peter Pearce. I, of course, cured them but they told me horrible things about TM. He told that there are three mantras given, for 300-pounds each, for different age groups. One is Ingah, another is Pinga and another is Thinga. All these three words are not Sanskrit. This guru, their guru does not know a word of Sanskrit. Nothing! Now Ingah means the bite of a scorpion and Pinga means when you get possessed where you go round and round, wrapping round, that’s Pinga, and Thinga means showing like this (Shri Mataji holds up her right thumb) to someone. For that you’ll pay 300, 300 pounds!
So now, there they have this program of flying in the air, no self-realisation, no spirit, nothing. First, you must thin down, absolutely. So, first, they had to pay 6000 pounds. Now, first they gave, first they gave water to drink for 6 days, with the water that has boiled potatoes and the 7th day, they gave them the ring (skin) of the potato and, the 8th day, the potatoes because people must thin down and then fly in the air you see. What is the need to fly in the air I don’t know because we are already having jams on the way, like this, if you start flying in the air, what’s the use? But such stupid ideas, if they give, and people want to go there with their stupidity then who can help them? And they broke their bottoms (coccyx) and now so many have (unintelligible).
They try all kinds of mesmerism, brain washing, and just want to make money, that’s all, as simple as that. And, if something happens to you, they say, no, no, you must go higher. You must do more. You must say the mantra more. All nonsense! They know that there is a market for seekers are there, so they just come. Sometimes some of them have just come out of jail! Such crooks they have no credibility, nothing, no position in the society, suddenly they elevate themselves.
This is to be understood, that what we have gained out of the particular guru whom we have been to, this we must find out! Then there are all nonsensical questions, you see, also which shows that people also some of them do not understand that you have to seek the truth and you have to find it; you have to be serious about it. There’s no stupidity about Sahaja Yoga. And, it is also not for the stupid, is not for the stupid. Those who are honest and those who are really seeking, the Sahaja Yoga will work out!
You yourself will become knowledgeable you yourself get all the knowledge. I told you yesterday that there were three doctors in Delhi who have got their MDs. But look at Russia, how sensible they are, they saw what these doctors have done in their work and immediately they have invited them, the government has invited them there. They don’t allow any false gurus to enter in there. Gorbachev is himself a Realized soul so he knows.
But where are the Realized souls? You see normally it is something, people go after the show, after the advertising, the show, it’s superficial things. I don’t mind even if you have to go for superficial people, go then but they harm you, they harm your Kundalini. And, you are seekers of truth since ages, not just today and you have to get it. The most surprising, from some of the questions I am surprised, they never doubted this false guru, but they doubt Me!
All right, there’s another nice question about Ha-Tha Yoga and other yogas and the relationship to Sahaja Yoga. Ha-Tha Yoga: "Ha" and "Tha" means both the nadis, the Surya and the Chandra Nadis, Sun and Moon channels. And the Patanjali has written such a big book, you see, and said that there are eightfold or you can say "ashtangas", meaning there are eight aspects of this yoga, Ha-Tha Yogas.
Out of this, one is Yaman Yama is the one discipline and exercises and all those things and a very wee bit of it is exercises. So, you see, unless and until your Kundalini rises you do not know what you are suffering from! And, then you start exercising then you are just doing something, supposing there’s a problem in your throat and you do the exercise for the stomach, what’s the use? So, first you must know, when the Kundalini rises, where is the problem and that when there is some physical problem then you can do a particular exercise. But these days, there’s a craze for exercise because everybody wants to thin out. They want to become thin like mosquitoes. And, when they get ill what happens to them? Such people who are all the time running after their body, worrying about the body, really have the worst body. They suffer from liver trouble, they suffer from diabetes they suffer from tensions, all kinds of things.
But if you become the spirit, the spirit looks after your body and you have to accept your body as it is. They want to look attractive, for what I don’t know, are we going to become prostitutes? If you become the spirit, you look so glorious, so beautiful so peaceful. Now you won’t believe, I’m 67 years of age and I travel practically every third day. I’ve no time for exercises or anything also sometimes I do not get any food to eat. Sometimes I sleep only for 2 hours, he (indicating the Greek Yogi translating) knows that, in the night and I feel very fresh and I always feel full of energy. There’s no tension, there’s no high blood pressure, there’s no problem, I have no problem, physical problem at all of any kind. No cholesterol, nothing of the kind that these people are worried. If you lead a pure life, you don’t create any problems but we pay undue importance to our body and really undue importance to nonsensical things.
For example, I know that I have to have a lot of water in my body because there are centres (chakras) and they have to be protected. I don’t mind. So one has to understand what is the purpose of this body but we should not be slave of this body or of our mind or of our fats. We have to use this body for our purpose. So this Ha-Tha has gone too far and I have seen people, most of them who are so serious about Ha-Tha yoga, have become so dry and mostly they have divorces. They always get heart attacks and they have all kinds of problems and they are so hot tempered you can’t go near them. You can’t even talk to them, you better use a barge pole if you want to (unintelligible).
So one has to understand that the greatest thing is to become the Spirit. There are so many yogas, there’s Raja Yoga, this, that and all those ashtangas, they are again artificial. When the Kundalini rises then all the centres open and close, and the Kundalini passes and again the centre close down so that it is kept up. But it works automatically. Like in the car, when you ignite the car all the machinery starts working automatically. Like when we eat the food, you see, the digestion starts working automatically. There is one, Raja Yoga, practiced by Yogananda and all those people in America, and I met some doctors from my place who were there in San Diego, they had cut the threads of the tongues and had a loose tongue like this, like dogs. So, I asked them what’s the matter why what have you done? They wrote it down that they had to cut the tongue because they must put back their tongue just to raise the Kundalini.
With this method (i.e. Sahaja Yoga) Kundalini rises, then your tongue will be a little bit pulled inside but you will not know. Because the Kundalini rises the chakra closes down you will not know but the tongue will be pulled inside. But this (i.e. Raja Yoga) is an artificial thing like without starting the car if you start moving the wheels will the car move? So these people have brought charges against them so they have now stopped this nonsense but the other nonsense is on!
I’ve told you it is a living process, which works. You can see with your naked eyes in some people the pulsation of the Kundalini of the Sacrum Bone, you can see the rising of the Kundalini and ultimately you feel the cool breeze coming out of your head and you can also feel the cool breeze around you. Then you must know what is to be done about it and you grow into it and then you become so powerful.
Now when I talk many people will come, I know that. You have faith in Me but you must have faith in yourself. You all can become like gurus, so why not? You do not have to pay anything for it. I think that covers most of the questions.
But now I will tell you what is the Nature of the Spirit. All this knowledge nobody knew because they haven’t got it. Now the first thing one should know that Spirit is the reflection of God Almighty and Kundalini is the reflection of the Primordial Mother whom we call as Adi Shakti but you call as Athena or in the Bible is called as the Holy Ghost, in the Koran it is called as Udrah and the Ruh is the Spirit. Now so what happens is that the Spirit is the cause because it is the reflection of one God Almighty, which is reflected in everyone but the reflection depends on the reflector. For example, if the reflector is just like a stone it doesn’t reflect. Then, gradually the reflector improves through evolutionary process and ultimately it starts showing better in a person who is a realised soul.
Then in a Sahaja Yogi, when he becomes an expert, then what happens the reflection becomes a complete thing. So the Nature of the Spirit is that it is the Collective Being within us. So when the Kundalini rises and when you get your Realisation what happens that you get a New Dimension of Awareness, which is Collective Consciousness. That means on your Central Nervous System you can feel the Centres that are yours and also the Centres of others. Jung has written about it clearly. So what happens is that the microcosm becomes the macrocosm. So we become part and parcel of the whole, you become aware. Now, this Spiritual Awareness when it is felt on your Central Nervous System is called as Bodha in Sanskrit language. And also Wither, Wither means Vedas come from the same, Wither means to Know on your Central Nervous System as a product of the evolutionary process.
So, in the Vedas also it is written, even Christ has written, everybody has written that you are to be born again. If you take an artificial certificate, I’m born again, nobody can help you but if you are born again then there are certain powers that you have.
In Sanskrit language, a person who is a born realised soul is called as Dwijaha and also a person who is a Realised Soul is a Dwijaha and, also a bird is a Dwijaha. So what comes first is an egg and then it becomes a bird and the bird has the power to fly. In the same way, in the same way, a human being is born and then he becomes a Realised Soul. That is the actualisation of Baptism. Because you become the Spirit, you become Collectively Conscious because Spirit is a Witness it is the premise of the witness state. So you can become Thoughtlessly Aware, there’s no reaction you just watch. Because Spirit is the source of all the knowledge you get all the absolute knowledge.
Now if you have ten children who are realised souls and you ask them what’s the matter with this gentlemen, close their eyes, you can put, tie their eyes up they will tell you this man is suffering from this finger, this finger whatever, everybody will pick out the same finger. Now, if you know the decoding as you have been shown here, decoding of the fingers, what is the centre catching, that’s the one.
So, also supposing there’s a false guru coming down, you put your hands towards him, immediately your hands will start burning. You can find out about everything, the absolute truth once you start feeling those Vibrations of Truth. So this is the quality of a saint, of the twice born.
Now the quality of the Attention, of the Attention of a Saint is that the Attention becomes powerful. Now for example, if you are not a realised soul, your Attention goes to joyless pursuits but your Attention, after realisation becomes enlightened and anywhere your Attention goes it works. Such a person has such pure innocent eyes that even a glance of such a person brings forth peace, joy and benevolence.
Christ has said that: “Thou shall not have adulterous eyes”. I’m Myself born in a Christian family and I’m trying to know how many Christians have eyes, which are not adulterous. He said “Thou shall not have adulterous eyes” because He resides in the Centre of Agnya, which is on the crossing of the Optic Chiasma, which is the crossing of the two optic nerves. But after Realisation it actually happens to you automatically that your eyes become non adulterous, become pure.
So, your attention becomes active. You pay attention to anybody and you can even cure that person just sitting down here. But the greatest thing of the Spirit is that it is the source of joy. Source of joy in a sense is that it is not like happiness and unhappiness, no duality, it is watching and in a joyous state. It’s a state, it cannot be described but just to be enjoyed but I’ve seen some of these people who are supposed to be gurus are so hot tempered, ba ba, you can’t say they are saints! They are only kind to very rich and evil people and, their disciples have no goodness about them.
So many things happen after Realisation but the most important thing is that you get connected to this All Pervading Power, which is a vital power. Before Realisation your prayers, mantras, japas has no meaning because there’s no connection at all. After this connection only we realise how much closer we are, how great we are. If you take say a television set in a village in India they’ll say what is this box? How can you see any pictures in this? But if you put it to the mains they can see the glory of the whole thing. In the same way we are very beautifully made they way this big mechanism is within us. And, when it starts working you are amazed at your own glory. Not only that but you become so dynamic, so compassionate, so wise and the transformation starts taking place within you. Physically you are cured, mentally you are evolved and emotionally you become a balanced personality. You really become powerful and you become absolutely filled. All habits drop out and you get rid of all kinds of addictions.
In the beginning in London, the people I got were all hippies and they were drug addicts, all of them were drug addicts and overnight they gave up drugs, overnight. I must say English are difficult people because they are hard nuts but once they get it they are the best Sahaja Yogis, I must say, in a way. Firstly, they are very scholarly and they know a lot and they just sort it out completely. Now there are seven doctors in England who are researching into Sahaja Yoga in a sense that they are trying to tabulate how many people are cured by Sahaja Yoga.
This state has to come to us, to human beings, otherwise how do you expect this world to be saved? Have you any other way around? If this is the thing, why shouldn’t you try to become what you have to be? And these are all your own powers. I don’t want Myself as your guru or anything but I’m your Mother and I’m just saying that this is your own power, for which you are not in anyway obliged to Me in anyway. I’m doing this work because I have to do it. I’m doing it for My own satisfaction. So you owe Me nothing!
If you owe anything to anyone, it is to yourself that you have to evaluate, you have to value your own life and that you have to understand that you have not been made from amoeba to human state for nothing at all. There is a great purpose behind it and you have to understand what is the purpose of your life. But in Sahaja Yoga you don’t have to sacrifice anything, you don’t have to give up anything, nothing of the kind. On the contrary, all the time you are blessed! But it is reality, it is not artificial, you have to become somebody. It is not just a certificate. You cannot purchase Me either. So, you have to become something, that’s the point. And, for that you don’t have to go into any (unintelligible). It is a collective happening that’s all. You have to just attend our centres, whatever they have, they’ll tell you all about it, they’ll give you all the knowledge and then they’ll make you the Spirit.
There’s a gentleman who met our boys, our small children, on the seashore who are Realized souls ten small children were there who are Realized. And, they caught hold of him because they knew he was a seeker. And, this gentleman was so much amazed at the wisdom of these children, the wisdom of these children. He told me the whole, he said I’m surprised to see such children, I’ve never seen such children, such peaceful, such sensible, such wise - and, he came to Sahaja Yoga. Also the idea that you must suffer, it’s all nonsense, there’s nothing to suffer. Christ has already suffered for us.
So, also to be very serious, you cannot laugh, you cannot jump, is all nonsense. A person who is a Realized soul is always bubbling with joy. So such joy in this serious work, it is like a fire, which is so gentle and so cooling. Now I must say about Samatis (name of translator) that I met him in Strasburg, he is a very deep person. And I told him, Samatis, are there people in Greece who are deep as you are because you are very ancient people like us and I expect a lot from you. Alexander the Great came to India and he saw these Indians and he said, I can’t rule these people.
And you will not believe that this Greece is described in our Puranas as the Manipur, the Manipur means the Nabhi Chakra already described in ancient times. It’s the navel of the Universe and there resides Athena it’s all described. How many things are described which I told when I came before. Everything is there still just the same. And it is the Devaloka means this is the area of the Gods and the mistake was I think that all the Gods were brought to human level. Instead of ascending to their level they were brought to human level. In India, we don’t do that way. It’s inauspicious. We have to rise up to their level. But you had Socrates, I mean, He was the Primordial Master. (Translator uses Greek pronunciation for Socrates) We too call him Sucaras – as you call him Sucaras.
There’re so many things in common and you’ll be surprised that thousands of years back even before Alexander so many Greeks lived in India. So it should not be difficult for us to understand deeper meaning of our lives because you have such a traditional history.
I think, they told me that these people, it is very late, it doesn’t matter even if you have programs they don’t go out in the night. But I think now we better have our Self Realisation. I’ve answered the questions that are sensible and I think any amount of answering is not going to give you Self Realisation. There’s no guarantee. It just has to work out. It takes some intelligence to establish but to fix it up it will take some time.
It is said that in the Vedas that after Self Realisation you must know Yantra, Mantra, Tantra. These (Mantras) are prayers or chanting that is to be used for different centres. And, Yantra means this mechanism, how it’s made and all those things. And, Tantra means technique.
But we have something called tantrikas in India who are doing black magic in the name of Kundalini and God. So many are arrested, and so many are harmed and they have been exposed but still you see these evil forces come up sometime. So it is for, very important for us to become the Spirit so that we know everything. All right, so shall we have the session for our Realisation now?
As I’ve told you that firstly, I respect your free will and it cannot be forced on anyone. So, those who do not want can go away from this hall, will be much better. But secondly, I have to tell you that, after Realisation, don’t waste your energies you must respect it. Otherwise, it will be like the parable of Christ, that some seeds fell on the rock and some seeds fell on the marshy land. So the half sprouted seeds are much worse than the not sprouted.
So please, we have a very good follow-on, we have a very good hall, these people are here, you don’t have to pay anything, you have to just become yourself. As your light will expand you will have all the knowledge and everything will be told you. There’s no secret in Sahaja Yoga.
I think we can take 5 minutes if they want to go out, let them go out (unintelligible) and then we’ll start the session. 5 minutes.
(Session resumes)
First condition is that you have to forget the past and don’t think of the future. The past has finished and your future doesn’t exist. So, forget the past, the best thing is not to feel guilty at all for anything, for any mistakes, for anything. What we remember of the past is only nonsensical things. So we are not to feel guilty at all! We are human beings and as human beings, after all we are not Gods so we make mistakes, doesn’t matter. So please forgive yourself completely. I’m requesting you again and again because when you feel guilty, the centre here on the left hand side catches so badly, on the left hand side. Especially in Greece I don’t know why do people feel so guilty, what wrong have you done? I don’t think they have done anything wrong, seriously, for the last 50 years I don’t know what wrong you have done?
The second condition is that you have to forgive everyone! Everybody you forgive, in general, not to think of any particular person or anything but just forgive everyone in general. Yesterday I explained to you that logically whether you forgive or you don’t forgive you don’t do anything. So what’s the use of playing into wrong hands? If you don’t forgive this centre, which I told you about, the Agnya, which is on the Optic Chiasma, gets constricted like that (Shri Mataji uses Her hands to illustrate the opening of Agnya) and the Kundalini cannot pass through. So please forgive. Forgive everyone! We are not going to lose our Self-realisation for somebody who is trying to torture us.
Now we have to understand that we have two powers, left and right, about which you will know more when you come to our centres, to our programs.
So you have to put your left hand towards Me, which is the power of your desire to get Self Realisation and you have to put your right hand for nourishing your centres, only on the left hand side (Shri Mataji indicates the left side of the body). Also, both the feet should be kept apart from each other. Now it is for us now to look at ourselves not at others. We have been looking at others so far now we have to look within ourselves. So later on we’ll close our eyes.
Please put your left hand towards Me like this, both the feet away from each other, take out your shoes because this Mother Earth helps us a lot.
So now please, put your right hand on your heart. In the heart resides the Spirit. Now you put your right hand in the upper portion of your abdomen ...