17 May 1979

Seeking & Evolution, Q&a

Public Program

Caxton Hall, London (England)

Talk Language: English | Transcript (English) – VERIFIED

I would say those who have come for the first time, should be in the front row, or the second row. Christine. Second row or first row. Please. Aap bhi samne aiye [you too come in front]. You see, if you leave the back seats vacant it will be better because there will be some more coming, I think, and occupy these front ones here.

So today we have a little introduction to Sahaja Yoga to begin with, because there are some new comers. You have read in many scriptures, that there is the Power of God that works out everything. Moreover, a human being does feel that there is something of the beyond, something beyond this own comprehension, that works out everything. Though we have heard about it, sometimes we get a glimpse of it also, it is not yet very well in our awareness or under our control that we can feel the divine Power. As I told you the other day, we are so confused about it because we do not know, we have not felt it. We have just accepted certain things because some people have told us, because it has been said again and again or somebody has tried to prove that you must have faith to understand. But actually, if it exists or not, whether there is God or not, itself is a big question, isn’t it?

So, to approach this question, either we start analysing it, rationalizing it, and as we have never reached this question through rationality, we negated it. Then another way then could be to understand that there is something lacking in us, something important, something we have to achieve. There is something less in our awareness. That’s why maybe we are not feeling. For example, animals do not feel the beauty. They do not feel the beautiful fragrance and they cannot discriminate between filth and cleanliness. In the same way, our awareness, whatever it is, a human awareness, may not be sufficient enough to feel that divine Power which is said to be all-pervading, all-doing, all-knowing, all-loving.

So, the human being has got the freedom to find it. And he tries, in his own methods, to find it out. In his own understanding, he works out how to achieve. But if you, if you think about our own awareness, how did we get it? Did we think about it? From amoeba to this stage how did we become human beings? Did we do anything about it? The higher state, at which human awareness is compared to animals, how did they, have rejoined it? What have they done? Nothing. You have done nothing to be a human being. I mean, we could have been animals. In the same way, to achieve that also, we are not going to do anything about it. The nature, the evolving force within us itself is going to do it and it will achieve it. But rather difficult to accept this concept that we cannot do anything about it.

I would say, when I am talking to you, you did not accept Me at all. It’s a hypothesis for you. And if it is proved, then you have to accept it, and see for yourself. But you are not to deny it also, hypothesis means, you keep it away to your doubt [unsure]. Now I have shown here a human being and he has 4 dimensions as you can see it clearly. One on the right-hand side, one on the left-hand side and one below him, and one on top of his head. Now, as I said it, you should accept it as a hypothesis. You can see here clearly, that the left-hand side and right-hand side, these two channels are absolutely connected and there is a gap in the central channel.

This is the subtle instrument, or you can say the scaffoldings of our being. And the centres are the subtle centres which work out our plexuses. For example, this first centre here down below manifests, controls, pelvic plexus. The second one, the yellow one there controls our aortic plexus. The third one controls our solar plexus. The one on top on the centre controls our cardiac plexus. The one here near the neck, controls the cervical plexus. And here on top is a passing point there, this centre controls ego and super ego and the pituitary and pineal. And above all that, is the centre where all these seven centres are controlled. That area is called as limbic area in the medical terminology. Now these subtle centres exist partly in our medulla oblongata in the back bone, and partly in the brain as shown there.

As I have said, man has got 4 dimensions, one on this side, one on this side, one on that side and one on that side. Now these two channels here, the left and right represent two powers which are within us. So, first one by which we exist, this channel in the Sanskrit language is called as the Ida Nadi and this controls the left sympathetic nervous system within human brain. And the right one is called as the Pingala Nadi and controls our creativity. It gives us creativity. The central one is our evolutional nadi, by which we evolve. And we have evolved only up to that point and this is the gap that is left within you. Because of this gap, you do not feel that All-pervading Power. Actually, it is the All-pervading Power which manifests everything else. Like you can see, in the mirror, you see the reflection. But the mirror you do not see because of the reflection. In the same way, this All-pervading Power is manifesting everything that is reflected on it, but cannot be seen because our attention is on the pattern, on the reflection, but not on the mirror itself.

Sahaja Yoga is a method which nature has employed from the very, very beginning, from when the carbon atoms or even earlier than that, when all the elements were created even when the creation was created. Sahaja, “Sahaja” means “with you, it is born”. “Saha” means “with”. “Ja” means “born”. It is born with you. Like you can see in a seed, you have got all the maps of all the trees that it is going to produce, and all the fruits it is going to produce. In the same way, it’s the seed of your being, all this was there gradually manifesting one, one being in you like physical being, then say emotional being, then your mental being, then your spiritual being and now the one that becomes one with the Creator.

All this has come out of one Being itself. Now, is there any method or not? The question is, is there any method to achieve this sprouting to a higher awareness or not? Is there any method by which you have to trigger it? I say, there is. And what is the method God has created in us? He has created this residual force here, you can see, which is called as Kundalini. It is called as ‘Kundalini’ because “Kundala” means a “coil”, it means a coil. And it is coiled here into three and a half coils, that’s why it is called as Kundalini. But this force is specially reserved, or is a residual force kept for this occasion, when you have to get this sprouting. In simple words, we can say, supposing there is a, now this instrument is here and it is recording my speech. But supposing if you do not put it to the mains, it has no meaning. In the same way, if you are not put to the mains, you have no meaning. And this Kundalini is the one, that is the cord within you, which connects you to the mains. But this is a living process. It is not like taking out a cord from your television or any one of the instruments. But it is a living process that starts sprouting just like a premule in a seed, and rises up and breaks this fontanelle bone area, which we call as Brahmarandhra. And takes your attention to that subtle awareness by which you feel this subtle All-pervading Power.

But we have problems, and the problems are, we are having these other dimensions also, out of which the left dimension which I said gives you the existence itself and also your emotions. Now if you try to be too much emotional, by going into this kind of emotional behaviour, you happen to go on this side more, sort of you get into a new balance and go on slipping of that side. When you go to that side, you are attacked by beings who are heavy in your past, who have something to do with your past. May be not in this life, may be in previous lives. May be some of them who are ‘busy bodies’ may not be related to you, may attack you too. And that’s how people become mad, they become schizophrenic and they get all the problems of the, what as we call the left side problems.

Now the right side, as I told you, is for our creativity. By the left side we think of the past. By the right side, we think of the future. What are we going to do tomorrow? I mean most of us are doing that, more that. We are not here ‘today’. At this moment, we are not here. We are thinking, "Now what are we going to do tomorrow?" Or you can say, we might be thinking, "Are we going to get a taxi or not? Is it going to rain or not?" But we are not thinking, that we are just now here, and we are just here. So, we are not on this. But we are on the future or on the past. We are all the time moving from the past to the future, future to past.

Now the future thinking also gives you a problem. If you start thinking too much for the future, of course ,plans always fail, that’s why the problem is there. You see, if you plan out anything it will go wrong, something will go wrong to prove that’s no use planning for the future too. It is as simple as this, that if you have to travel, say, to an unknown country, then if you plan out that, “I will be going to the right and then to the left”, you cannot do it. You must see what side of the road is full. Because if you just plan out, supposing there is no road on the left, if you go on the left, you will be in a ditch. In the same way, the planning too much business also causes too much extreme movement to this side.

And when you move too much to this side [the past], you become emotionally also, very much we react and imbalance is created. This can also create imbalance. People can become lethargic. You see, we had some patients here, they were all of crying mind, crying and crying, doing no work. Extremely lethargic people. You must have also met some people, whatever you may try, give them injections or anything, they would not get. That type. So, they are the people who read melancholic songs and all the time they are speaking as Romeos, are crying and weeping, killing their time and torturing others and extremely boring. That type.

The other types are very ambitious and all the time talking about the future plans. And they cannot sit quiet for one minute, because they are all the time planning for the future. That type are on the right-hand side. And if this type goes too far to this side, they are also attacked by such ambitious people [dead souls] who are around, and they can become over ambitious. So, a vicious circle sets in, and you get a whole society behaving in a very funny manner, in a very sickly manner. Everybody is running up and down. You don’t know what are they after, you just can’t understand what are they afraid of, and where are they up to. So, that sort of a thing can also happen to a person. Or this kind of that can happen if you go too much out of the balance.

Now, this central path is of temperance, is absolutely of temperance: not overdoing something. Like you are going on a road, say, you are driving down to the airport. Now, you are going just enjoying the drive, just see the flowers that are out, the spring is out, you see the colours and all that. But not only this is never done, but what you will see, "Look at this, these people have not yet cleaned this. They have not yet- this police must be told that they must put this sign like that; why don’t?" I mean, you’ll work for the police, you’ll work for the sweepers, you’ll work for all the rest of the world, but you will not see what is there in the nature. That sort of a thing happens with this kind of people and they are very dissatisfied with themselves and with others. They call themselves ‘perfectionists’ but it’s quite difficult to be in their company. And they can be quite mad too, you see. They do not realize it, but they could be very mad people. And sometimes when they talk, you start wondering, "What’s the matter with these people, how are they behaving in this manner?” But the central path is that for temperance, is just to be careful.

"Now what is to be done about religion", people ask Me. Now you please keep quiet about it. What is to be done in religion, is not to do anything nonsensical, that’s all! I mean, when people say, “What should we do for religions?” Now I mean, “You don’t do it.” I mean, it’s all mostly ’don’ts’. You are not doing anything about it because it’s mostly ‘don’ts’. So, you just don’t do this, that’s all. But people think that even for religion, you have to do something. As you are, just keep yourself as you are, and the thing will work out, and this is the sustenance, which is very important within you. And this is the human sustenance, very, very important for human beings. Those who have got this balancing power, in the centre, are the easiest persons. But you know that we have people who are seekers. And in seeking, they go all out, headlong into everything, without even considering what sort of a thing they are moving in. And in that headlong, you see, they are many who are smiling, because they have been, some of us sitting here, have been there through it, and what problems they created to find this [unclear].

The first thing that happens to them is that these chakras go into a kind of a chaos. These chakras are simply made of, out of left and right side, the Ida and Pingala. Say, left and right they come across and the chakra is formed. Now, if you start moving too much, any one of these they can get dislocated. Once they are dislocated, they become on their own. Because this is the way they are connected to the whole, and you become on your own. That is also very common this one, "I am on, on my own". Now how can you be on your own, when you are a part and parcel of the whole? Supposing you become on your own, it’s cancerous. You become a cancerous cell, because you have to keep the relation with the whole. And when this starts happening, then you develop horrible disease called as cancer. It’s as simple as that. Every day you are bringing up cancer, every day we are solving it. But that is done through the central path which is manifested with parasympathetic nervous system, which gives us all the balance, all the harmony, all the supply of energy.

But the energy is limited and if you use it too much, then any disease, which is manifested because of a malfunction of these centres, can be. If you could keep these centres all right, then there could not be any disease. There could not be any madness or lunacy and all these imbalances. But you would be a very pleasant nice person just like a flower. Let the flower remain as it is and become a fruit, because that is innately built to be in every person to become fruit. This is Sahaja Yoga; this is the promise of God. ‘Sahaja’ is ‘with you’, is spontaneously going to work out this process of becoming the fruit, giving you your own nutriment. It will work out if you are not letting too much [indulgences]. But perhaps it is rather difficult, after a certain age, to find some of you who have not that. Some of them are Romeos, or some of them are great seekers, you see, they have taken to horrible methods of seeking, like standing on their heads all their life, or standing on their feet or do all kinds of funny stuff. And you must have seen hippies dancing in the Oxford Street or doing all other nonsensical things. Not good. You give up your family, you become a ‘sanyasi’, you become this and develop a- shave off your head and put a small little ‘choti’ [braid] as you call it, behind, as tail. It’s not necessary at all.

God has not made you to make yourself miserable. Not at all. He loves you and He loves you very, very dearly and He wants you to enjoy yourself. He has made your instrument in such a manner, that you are going to enjoy yourself. This is the way He wants you to look at yourself. And when you start torturing yourself, what should we call it? There is no torture needed at all. People have another idea that you must suffer, if you have to go to God. I mean, imagine such a thing! That is the greatest insult to God. God wants you to be happy, to be joyous, completely one with yourself. He doesn’t want you to be unhappy by any chance. Only thing is that, if you have to be one with Him, then you should be clearing chakras. You need not do anything extraordinary. It is a simple thing which I do not know why people require so much of explanation. Supposing you are going in a boat, now you don’t sit on one side. If you sit on one side, it will topple down. You sit in the centre. Everyone understands that if you are in the centre, you are just there, on your gravity and you have your own sustenance quite intact. But it happens like that.

Moreover, it is not an artificial thing by which you can work it out. For example, it will work out in some people, it may not work out in some people. It may take some time with some people; it may not take time at all! But when it happens, what happens to you, that I think I should not tell you, because I think you should feel for yourself and you should know that when it happens to you, you start feeling cool vibrations flowing in just a stream. And through those both hands, you find a cool breeze flowing from them. But if it is not flowing then you- it is not a thing of pride. But on the contrary, you should come back and get up again. You should establish and have it. That’s the thing. If you are really the seeker, then you must know it is your right to have it.

And this is a very simple thing. It has to be so very simple. How can it be complicated? Because it is essential. It is the most important thing that’s why it has to be extremely simple. Supposing our breathing, you have to do by reading books, what would have happened? So, by reading books, you cannot get it. It is so important, just like our breathing. So, how can it be difficult? How can it be a hazardous? It has to be simplest. But we have made ourselves upside down, topsy-turvy. What can one do about it? You see only thing you can try is to get it straight and work it out. There is no use doubting anything about it. Because by doubting what have you achieved? And the first thing that comes to people is doubting.

Now if you understand there is nothing in selling here. No, it is not. If you understand this point very well that this is not a shop. We are not selling anything here, all right? Then what are we doing? It’s a gift. It’s a gift and if it’s a gift, you are not going to doubt it. If you are going to doubt it, then you sit down with your doubts and go on convincing yourself. But that doesn’t mean that you blindly follow Me. It will happen to you. If it happens well and good. If it will not happen, you are willing to work with Me. Now, you are not to work it. Till you get it. Once you have got it, like a swimmer who knows how to swim can only save you. But those who do not know how to swim, they just fall and die. It is so simple as that. But there is nothing to fear also, I think, that if I say this, ego should become challenged. Nothing to feel bad about it. Because after all, all of us have to go to the other side of the road.

So, it’s only a question of how you pass it and how you learn. Those who know the art can do it for you, and then you just take their course, and then you do it for others. It’s very simple, like one light enlightens another light. Now the light which is not enlightened cannot be enlightened by itself. But what is the obligation of the light which is enlightened? See now, no obligations at all. So, one should not also feel obliged. One should not even feel that some great work has been done, neither one should feel also sort of dominated.

It’s a very free thing; it has to be absolutely accepted in your own freedom and absolutely in your own seeking. There cannot be any force about it. You have to ask for it. You have to ask for it. If you do not ask for it, nobody is going to fall at your feet and say, “Sir please have it!” Of course, being a Mother, I will try to tell you stories, and give you some chocolate. But, you see, it has its own protocol. And one has to go with that protocol and must know we are asking for the Supreme. You are asking for the supreme joy. For what you are, what you have been seeking and I assure you, you must have it: that is your right and you must have your right, but in a proper way.

If there is any question you ask Me, because it’s a very big subject. You know that I have, must have given them eighty-four lectures, and this is now the eighty fifth here, in this hall. So, you can imagine how big is the subject, if you go into details. But just now, I think it’s so sufficient just to give an introduction of subject. Now, if you have any question please ask, but ask sensible question. Thank you.

You are not thinking. You see, that happens. You see, when the Kundalini comes up over your Agnya, you just cannot think. The thoughtless, thoughtless awareness, what you call the Nirvachara samadhi, sets in.

[INTERACTIONS WITH SEEKERS]

Seeker: Is the cool breeze for [unclear] or are we [unclear]? Shri Mataji: How do you, how do you feel it? Seeker: I feel it [unclear]. Shri Mataji: We know you have a problem, my child. That’s it, that’s keeping it out. You got your Realization all right, but you were committing mistakes, all right? You are all right, you will get it. As soon as the problem goes away, you will get it. You’re better now? Are you better? Seeker: Yes. Shri Mataji: Much better, your shaking is much better. You are improving. Still shaking? Seeker: It’s OK [unclear]. Shri Mataji: [Unclear].Don’t you worry. You are feeling the cool breeze. It’s surrounding you. So, feel it comforting you. It is surrounding all. It’s all over. It’s just there, it works out everything.

It’s hot. [Shri Mataji is laughing] Put your hands like that, just hands. Please take out your shoes, you’ll feel better. [Unclear].

Shri Mataji: How are you, Simon? Simon: Fine Shri Mataji: Put your hands towards Me, like this. [Unclear part]

Just close your eyes. Now what is going to happen to you? First of all, if you watch your thoughts, most of you will feel that there is no thought in your mind. Most of you, I would not say all of you, but most of you are feeling there is no thought. If you see that what your mind is thinking, you will feel that it is blank, something. Then, after some time, you will feel cool breeze flowing. Flowing into your hands.

Now, at one of the centres, you see, it stops in most of us. The thing is, you have to forgive others. When you are asking for the Supreme, you must forgive them, forgiveness is very important. Because it’s a myth to remember what others have done to you. Just forgive others. Just forgive them. It’s only sane that you forgive. Actually, by not forgiving or forgiving, you don’t do anything. You only play in their hands when you don’t forgive. Just forgive.

[Unclear] Why are you shaking? [Unclear conversation with the seeker.] Liver. Put your left hand on your liver, this side. Left hand, yes. [Unclear] Are you feeling? Are you feeling the cool breeze? [Unclear conversation with the seeker.] Are you getting?

He’s got Hamsa. Have you been doing Pranayama? [Unclear conversation with the seeker.] That’s it, going to another extreme.

Are you getting anything [Mickael]? Seeker: Yes. Shri Mataji: Good.

You, are you all right now? All right. Put your left hand on your liver. Your liver. Left hand. Cathy, can you tell? Can you please tell her?

[Unclear conversation with the seeker.]

You did Hatha Yoga also? Seeker: Yes. [Unclear]. Shri Mataji: What? Seeker: In few centres of Hatha Yoga [unclear]. Shri Mataji: You see, it’s a very wrong concept of Hatha Yoga we have here. It’s only physical. It’s not physical, if you read Patanjali asthanga, True [unclear] is to be done only when you are leading a very celibate life in a jungle with your Guru, from five to twenty-five years of age. But this one is only meant for becoming actors and actresses, it’s too much. [Shri Mataji is laughing.]

[Unclear conversation with the seeker.]

Thank you. He’s well. Fine. [Shri Mataji is laughing.] Now, you found it.

I think if you can get in and see their vibrations a little bit. Now you all, new people do not get disturbed, these people will just come and feel your vibrations, that’s all. You just keep quiet and close your eyes. They’ll just come and feel your vibrations, if there is any trouble. Just close your eyes. Just close your eyes and just don’t be disturbed. They will not touch you.

He’s got it? He looks so different on the face itself. Showing on the face itself, you see, relax. Enjoy yourself.

Seeker: Mother, I have some trouble here. Shri Mataji: I beg your pardon? Seeker: I have little trouble hearing you, that’s all. [Shri Mataji is speaking about this problem with the seeker]

[Unclear conversations from far]

Shri Mataji: What are you thinking about? What are you thinking about, I just can’t understand.

[Unclear conversations between Sahaja Yogis and seekers] [End of audio]